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Context: "He didn't say a word about the accident in front of us(,) kids."

I think the comma here may slightly change the meaning if used/not used. However, is the variant with no comma okay in literary, narrative style?

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    If the speaker is or was a child, it's perfect without the comma. With the comma an adult is telling some kids, "We never heard a word about the accident."
    – Old Brixtonian
    May 12, 2021 at 7:52
  • You shouldn't accept my answer yet! :) I'm still editing. I just realized that the sentence may be ambiguous.
    – Mohd Zulkanien Sarbini
    May 12, 2021 at 7:55
  • @user178049: So did I :) I'm not sure which meaning the OP wants.
    – Old Brixtonian
    May 12, 2021 at 7:56
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    The comma is not required, and it's not an appositive. "Us" is used informally here instead of the personal determinative "we", and is a determiner in the NP "us kids" functioning as complement of the preposition "of".
    – BillJ
    May 12, 2021 at 8:07

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He didn't say a word about the accident in front of us(,) kids.

The comma is not required, and it's not an appositive.

"Us" is used informally here instead of the personal determinative "we", and is a determiner in the noun phrase "us kids" functioning as complement of the preposition "of".

The personal determinatives "we" and "you", are also found in noun phrase subjects:

[We supporters of Brexit] will eventually win the argument.*

[You students] should form a society.*

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  • If you put a comma there, will it still be an NP? I think it is only an NP when there is not comma. (I don't disagree. I'm genuinely confused :)
    – Mohd Zulkanien Sarbini
    May 12, 2021 at 8:36
  • @178049 No: "us kids" would not be an NP. The NP complement of the prep "of" would be just the personal pronoun "us". "Kids" would be an ascriptive NP supplement, i.e. not integrated into the NP functioning as comp of "of".
    – BillJ
    May 12, 2021 at 9:26
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This is not an appositive. "Kid" here is a vocative and the comma that precedes it is called a vocative comma. According to Macmillan Dictionary Blog, the choice may be influenced by formality or sometimes just personal preference. In literary style, I think it is fine to leave it out.

In informal or unedited ­writing, the vocative comma is often skipped. If you’re emailing or texting a friend or family member, it may seem unduly fussy to you to include the comma after ‘Hi’. If you’re writing a formal letter, on the other hand, leaving out the vocative comma may seem too casual. In between these two poles there is much variation, which can depend on context, personal preference, and the writer’s awareness of the options.

(Stan Carey, Macmillan Dictionary Blog, 2020)

However, keep in mind that a lack of a punctuation mark can kill people. So, meaning is also important and should be paid attention to.

In your sentence, the comma is required because the lack of comma can alter the meaning of the sentence. "Us kids" may be interpreted as a noun phrase with "us" as a determiner. In that case, "They didn't say a word about the accident in front of us kids" would imply that the speaker is a kid speaking on behalf of other kids about their not being informed about the accident!

In short, a comma in a vocative construction is optional, but the choice may be influenced by:

  1. Formality
  2. Personal preference
  3. Meaning and ambiguity
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  • thank you, but I disagree that it's a vocative comma since it's not a direct speech.
    – Diane Mik
    May 12, 2021 at 7:55
  • @Diane could you please tell use what exactly you want your sentence to express? The sentence is ambiguous.
    – Mohd Zulkanien Sarbini
    May 12, 2021 at 8:40

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